Estonia ESTONIA 2024 - 5miinust & Puuluup - (nendest) narkootikumidest ei tea me (küll) midagi

[ESC United Mod Team]

 

[eerik]

Eesti Laul was born during recession and austerity. Not having money is a poor excuse. How much did they spend on JESC that nobody cares about?

 

[laululind]

Well, the first two didn't have any semi finals at all so that probably helped. Also the '09 edition (and semis from 2011 onward) being studio shows rather than big live concerts. But yeah, if EL was a bigger priority, they could probably find more money at the expense of some other stuff. But then you'd probably have other people complaining that EL is getting all the money while the other shows are left with less. There's always someone unhappy when budgets are concerned.
I still say they should find some suitable studio and go back to pre-recorded semi performances if need be. It worked for years after all.

I guess you'd need to have inside ERR information to know how much the JESC participation cost and if they had sponsors and why they suddenly decided to take part anyway. Maybe they got a big discount from the EBU, or had money left over for children's programming? Would be very interesting to have some insight but alas, don't have the necessary contacts.

 

[Paco Roca]

While 5miinust & Puulup may seem like the craziest choice, in a good way, while acknowledging originality, their song is cacophonous and messy. I prefer Ollie's Grunge/Alternative Metal. Ollie's voice reminds me slightly, this pleased me, of the lead singer of Nickelback.

 

[rasmuslights]

EWERT AND THE TWO DRAGONS – "Hold Me Now" // EESTI LAUL 2024 SEMI-FINAL

Authors: Ewert Sundja, Erki Pärnoja, Ivo Etti, Kristjan KallasAll rights belong to the Estonian Public Broadcasting.http://eestilaul.ee/

www.youtube.com

this is my winner

 

[rasmuslights]

Ollie is still too derivative for me.

 

[Ajeje Brazorf]

Let's not bring "Leto Svet" into the conversation if you do not understand it or the context around it.

Leto Svet was the culmination of Estonia's frustration with Eurovision Song Contest and our own pre-selection Eurolaul in the mid-2000s.

Main factors that lead to "Leto Svet":

• Estonia's poor performance at the Eurovision Song Contest itself. We went from constantly being in the top10 (and winning) to being stuck in the semis for years, with our results getting worse and worse each time. "Eighties Coming Back" finishing 21st in 2003 was a pivotal moment, forcing us to the semifinal in 2004. Vaiko Eplik, the frontman of Ruffus/Claire's Birthday, was personally labeled as "the guy who fucked up Eurovision". He was verbally and physically abused by idiots for years, even had to hire a bodyguard. That's how seriously/passionately some people in Estonia took Eurovision. It is kind of a miracle that Eplik managed to recover from this, having his most creative and successful years after all that.
• ESC rapidly expanding to more countries. Our years of poor results concided with a lot of new countries debuting at the contest. Those countries were mostly from Balkans and Caucasus, regions we don't really care about that much. This mean't there was even bigger competition for qualifying to the final, and there were a lot more songs that we did not like. Furthermore, these were also the years when countries from said regions did well. We gave 0 points to the winning entries of Turkey in 2003, Greece in 2005, and Serbia in 2007. Before that, the average points we had given to the winning entries was 9.7. With the exception of 4 points to Israel in 1998, the winning entry had always received at least 8 from us.
• Eurolaul being stagnant yet flip-floppy. "Eighties Coming Back" in 2003 was hated not only because of it's poor result at the Eurovision, but also because it was selected by international jury over a huge public favourite -- "Club Kung Fu" by Vanilla Ninja, which was dead last in the jury ranking. Backlash from all this made Eurolaul finally switch to televoting, however, after 2 years of televoting winners failing, they switched back to international jury, same story, rinse and repeat. So, in the final years of Eurolaul, Juhan Paadam, the our head of delegation and producer of Eurolaul, started toying around with the pre-selection process. There was a year when only invited songwriters could take part, eventhough the invitees were mostly people who had participated in Eurolaul for over a decade and would have done it anyway. For 2008, I believe it was 5 open spots + 5 invited songwriters. Priit Pajusaar, the man behind "Kaelakee hääl" in 1994 and "Diamond of Night" in 1999, was one of the invited songwriters who got a free pass to the final. He, sharing the frustrations of many other Estonians, gave us "Leto Svet".

"Leto Svet" was never a genuine attempt to be funny or to appeal to anybody in Europe. It was a "fuck you" to Eurovision and Eurolaul after years of bad results and frustration that came along with it. And it worked, the following year we got rid of Juhan Paadam and Eurolaul, replaced them with Heidy Purga and Eesti Laul, and we have done relatively well ever since. We have had as many top10 finishes as we have had non-qualifications in the Eesti Laul era. Our friends and favourites have also done well in the competition during that time. Our best buddies Finland and Sweden being the top2 and us being 8th last year was like a perfect outcome.

None of the Eesti Laul entries since 2009 share anything in common with "Leto Svet", nor is there a reason that there should be another one.

This year's Eurovision will be very similar to ESC2008, though: in 2008 we had the "Serduchka effect" with countries sending out of the box silly entries trying to replicate the success of that song in 2007 or to just say: "Europe, you voted for that? Well your taste is awful, now vote for us!" (ex. Ireland and their not so many Douze points), failing badly. This year we will have the "Käärja effect": lots of camp songs and out of the ordinary song, in National languages, trying to be as out of the box as possible to be successful.

That is why I don't know if 5miinust & Puulup will be Estonia's best choice this year, even though I kinda like the song, for example. Just imagine if they win, windows95man wins UMK, Go Tobann wins Eurosong, My AI wins MGP, Rim tim dagi dim or Babaroga wins Dora and they all get sorted in the same semi. They will fuck their chances one with the other and the only one which can gain something from this situation is Ireland, because it is on a NQ streak that in this situation can be broken.

 

[frankenstein123]

To me it's pretty clear that Ollie would maybe squeak through to the final of Eurovision and then pull a Jezebel. I just see nothing at all exciting or interesting in this. 5MIINUST x Puuluup are a gamble, but they are an exciting gamble. Anything could happen with the result, but they would be achieving it while bringing Estonian back to ESC, mixing together the styles of two beloved and very unique musical groups and showing off some traditional instruments and dance moves. There's just so much more here to appreciate, at least for me. Can't wait to vote for them in our Eesti Laul final!

 

[Paco Roca]

To me it's pretty clear that Ollie would maybe squeak through to the final of Eurovision and then pull a Jezebel. I just see nothing at all exciting or interesting in this. 5MIINUST x Puuluup are a gamble, but they are an exciting gamble. Anything could happen with the result, but they would be achieving it while bringing Estonian back to ESC, mixing together the styles of two beloved and very unique musical groups and showing off some traditional instruments and dance moves. There's just so much more here to appreciate, at least for me. Can't wait to vote for them in our Eesti Laul final!

I understand what you're saying. 5miinust & Puulup are a risky choice but can also follow the path of "Shum".

 

[BernadetteCydonia]

Also people who like "nendest..", but think Ollie is a better fit for Eurovision.

Oh come on that's just not fair now. When it comes to national finals, vote honestly based on what you support, or don't vote at all.

 

[henhu]

Odds for 5 Miinust and Puuluup are as low as 1.30 in some bookies. For reference, I think Elina Born & Stig Rästa had 1.40 some days before the final.

 

[eerik]

Well, the first two didn't have any semi finals at all so that probably helped. Also the '09 edition (and semis from 2011 onward) being studio shows rather than big live concerts. But yeah, if EL was a bigger priority, they could probably find more money at the expense of some other stuff. But then you'd probably have other people complaining that EL is getting all the money while the other shows are left with less. There's always someone unhappy when budgets are concerned.
I still say they should find some suitable studio and go back to pre-recorded semi performances if need be. It worked for years after all.

ERR's annual budget shrank about 10% between 2008 and 2010, and stayed stagnant for another 5 years before it started growing again. While making the cuts for 2010 budget, there were ideas of us pulling out of ESC completely, yet, during those "no money" years they managed to make the final a live public concert (like it was in the 90s Eurolaul before Paadam took over) and introduce semi-finals.

As you said, they could take the semi-finals back to pre-recorded studio performances to save money, though I appreciate that Rahula took Eesti Laul to cities other than Tallinn, might be the only good thing he did with EL. Karmel Killandi said that the current Eesti Laul is produced by television-oriented crew (as opposed to music business people like Purga or Rahula), so they should have a good understanding of how to produce it cheaply if needed.

 

[laululind]

Oh come on that's just not fair now. When it comes to national finals, vote honestly based on what you support, or don't vote at all.

No arguments from me! And I think there aren't too many people that think like that.. but I've definitely seen a few comments of that nature. 5Miinust is great but not for Eurovision, they'd probably flop, Ollie would do better. I imagine most of those people like both songs anyway.. would someone really vote for a song they hate just because they think it would do well? Who knows, maybe they would! But I think such people are a rather tiny minority.

Odds for 5 Miinust and Puuluup are as low as 1.30 in some bookies. For reference, I think Elina Born & Stig Rästa had 1.40 some days before the final.

I'd be a little wary about giving them such low odds. The juries still worry me here. Tried making a quick prediction for the final votes.. 5Miinust didn't make the superfinal.

Total-TV-Jury
20--08+12 Daniel Levi "Over The Moon"
18--10+08 Ollie "My Friend"
16--06+10 Ewert and The Two Dragons "Hold Me Now"
14--12+02 5miinust ja Puuluup "(nendest) narkootikumidest ei tea me (küll) midagi"
12--07+05 Anet Vaikmaa "Serotoniin"
12--05+07 Uudo Sepp, Sarah Murray "Still Love"
08--04+04 Brother Apollo "Bad Boy"
08--02+06 Carlos Ukareda "Never Growing Up"
04--03+01 Peter Põder "Korra veel"
04--01+03 Nele-Liis Vaiksoo "Käte ümber jää"

But trying to guess what the EL juries will vote for is a total crapshoot. Never would have thought they'd have Wingman second in 2021, or Bedwetters second last year. And we've yet to even see half the performances live. Guess we'll have to hope there are at least a few more adventurous jury members in there, willing to rate something a little more different highly too. It just feels like "nendest.." is the kind of song juries might dislike. If 5Miinust doesn't make the superfinal, Ollie probably has it in the bag, which I wouldn't be angry about either. But I'd rather both made the superfinal and televoters got to pick who they prefer, fair and square. Guess we'll have to wait and see!

 

[Franzilein]

Ollie's attempt from last year was one of my favourites among all national finals. My Friend ain't quite it for me I'm afraid, takes too long to lift off. BUT he's so good live and elevates the song a lot. Would love to see him at the ESC, Europe is definitely missing out on him

 

[lasse braun]

If 5Miinust doesn't make the superfinal, Ollie probably has it in the bag,

the possibility that ollie could fail to reach the superfinal is much higher in my opinium.

 

[Realest]

Ollie's attempt from last year was one of my favourites among all national finals. My Friend ain't quite it for me I'm afraid, takes too long to lift off. BUT he's so good live and elevates the song a lot. Would love to see him at the ESC, Europe is definitely missing out on him

Im pretty sure his Time will come soon, probably 2027-28.
But I fear not this Time.

 

[BernadetteCydonia]

"5Miinust is great but not for Eurovision, they'd probably flop, Ollie would do better."

they should start wanting songs in Eurovision not based on what would do better in Eurovision for a moment

 

[laululind]

the possibility that ollie could fail to reach the superfinal is much higher in my opinium.

Well, he was 3rd with the juries last year, so I'm not expecting him to completely flop this year either. Of course the jury members will be different so in theory they might hate rock. But since he's got decent vocals & overall package, I don't see him lower than midtable with juries, which would be enough for the superfinal.

they should start wanting songs in Eurovision not based on what would do better in Eurovision for a moment

I guess, to play devil's advocate, most people want to see their country do well. One can listen to quality music every day of the week on their own, but Eurovision only happens once per year! So if someone truly believed the song they liked had no hope to succeed, I can see the logic behind voting for their next best choice instead. Kind of like having a really cool friend who's awesome and lovely, but really sucks at sports.. you're not going to send them off to the Olympics just because they're lovely. Of course these days, "not for Eurovision" is a pretty dated view, since we've seen many different genres do well. So if you only laser-focus on what you think is a "suitable Eurovision song", you probably miss out on potential to do much better than expected. It might be more risky, but sometimes it's worth taking a small risk instead of going for a generic tired formula.
Or I guess you could just vote for both songs, the one you really like and the one you think would do well.

 

[eerik]

YouTube stats update. Main (music video) uploads only:

Performer	Song	Views	Likes	Comments
5MIINUST x Puuluup	(nendest) narkootikumidest ei tea me (küll) midagi	610,341	8,064	662
OLLIE	My Friend	203,619	4,284	510
Traffic	Wunderbar	123,632	1,868	109
YONNA	I Don't Know About You	103,181	354	40
Anet Vaikmaa	Serotoniin	77,109	1,000	116
Daniel Levi	Over the Moon	72,614	1,362	201
Cecilia	FOMO	68,408	1,324	137
Brother Apollo	Bad Boy	57,670	489	46
Sofia Rubina	Be Good	44,694	138	37
Cartoon, Ewert Sundja	Oblivion	36,383	687	55
INGA	No Dog on a Leash	34,935	550	56
Ingmar	Dreaming	33,184	752	129
Peter Põder	Korra veel	31,261	366	35
Uudo Sepp, Sarah Murray	Still Love	30,990	345	28
Nele-Liis Vaiksoo	Käte ümber jää	27,911	269	22
Carlos Ukareda	Never Growing Up	27,706	358	30
Ewert and The Two Dragons	Hold Me Now	24,741	315	33
Laura	Here's Where I Draw the Line	22,817	234	34
Antsud	Vetevaim	21,125	327	56
Silver Jusilo	Lately	19,272	179	19
Cartoon, Ewert Sundja	Oblivion (Liquicity upload)	14,205	601	22

Weekly views:

Performer	Song	Weekly views
5MIINUST x Puuluup	(nendest) narkootikumidest ei tea me (küll) midagi	136,939
Traffic	Wunderbar	38,846
OLLIE	My Friend	30,098
Anet Vaikmaa	Serotoniin	18,745
Daniel Levi	Over the Moon	15,348
Sofia Rubina	Be Good	14,818
Cecilia	FOMO	12,391
Brother Apollo	Bad Boy	7,090
Carlos Ukareda	Never Growing Up	6,158
Peter Põder	Korra veel	5,633
Uudo Sepp, Sarah Murray	Still Love	5,546
Nele-Liis Vaiksoo	Käte ümber jää	5,293
Cartoon, Ewert Sundja	Oblivion	4,475
INGA	No Dog on a Leash	4,222
Ewert and The Two Dragons	Hold Me Now	3,925
Ingmar	Dreaming	3,515
Antsud	Vetevaim	3,316
Cartoon, Ewert Sundja	Oblivion (Liquicity upload)	2,840
Laura	Here's Where I Draw the Line	2,471
YONNA	I Don't Know About You	2,343
Silver Jusilo	Lately	2,338

Stats on semifinal live performances from the (official?) Eesti Laul YT channel:

Performer	Song	Views	Likes	Comments
5MIINUST x Puuluup	(nendest) narkootikumidest ei tea me (küll) midagi	110,357	2,188	445
OLLIE	My Friend	44,071	1,485	259
Traffic	Wunderbar	27,790	445	73
Cecilia	FOMO	23,426	618	143
Anet Vaikmaa	Serotoniin	16,606	329	55
Ewert and The Two Dragons	Hold Me Now	10,767	207	50
INGA	No Dog on a Leash	8,454	277	48
Peter Põder	Korra veel	8,246	127	31
Cartoon, Ewert Sundja	Oblivion	7,852	172	38
Laura	Here's Where I Draw the Line	4,299	98	24
Antsud	Vetevaim	4,226	135	18
Ingmar	Dreaming	4,085	119	32
YONNA	I Don't Know About You	2,623	75	7
Silver Jusilo	Lately	2,497	43	8
Sofia Rubina	Be Good	2,170	49	13

 

[Earthland2]

I can't believe how many people believe it's the duel between Ollie and 5miinust/puuluup. I mean, if Ollie didn't win last year with a much better song ... ? It's been clear to me since day one that Daniel is going to win (and will do quite well at the ESC as well). Mark my words.

 

[laululind]

What an anticlimactic choice that would be. Truly cement our reputation as the country who always picks the bland mid safe songs, no matter what we have on offer. But we certainly can't rule it out. Very hard to judge tho', since he hasn't performed yet. Feedback so far is all about 5Miinust and Ollie, but who knows what the case will be once he's actually been on stage. Guess we won't know until the final. Haven't seen him live yet either, could be decent or a vocal disappointment.

Personally I hope either 5Miinust or Ollie manage to beat him to the punch. Sending a second ballad in a row would be a bit of a drag. Can't we pick something different for a change? Also if Ant enters next year with another power ballad & wins, that would be 3 ballads in a row! That's major ballad overdose. Well, if Daniel's song was truly exceptional or great at least, but it's pleasantly mediocre at best IMO. Wish he would have gone with his usual style, something more groovy and interesting.