Rule Discussion: NSC 70+ ~ A NEW SUGGESTION!

[takeru]

As you might remember, every 10 editions, I like to remind you of this thread (click).
Although it might seem hidden away in the Private Forum, this thread is the best place to voice any rule change suggestions you have, and as you can see, every single suggestion is well considered in the first post (even if they're unrealistic)

At the moment, the first post has suggestions from way back in NSC 50, and many of them are yet to be fulfilled.
However, now may be the time for change!

Of the initial suggestions from that thread, one of the most popular was:
*More than 1 rejuer per semi

A month or so ago, we had our first official live NSC mod conference (OK, it wasn't really that, but me, Adam and Joch met up xD). During this meetup, we came up with a new idea, directed at this, a combined qualifier.

A brief explanation:
*The reju is now more popular and representative than ever, so it's a good time to give it more focus
*Simply adding a 2nd qualifier creates the problem of there being "one rejuer better than the other"
*Recent threads in NSC suggest that the songs that just miss out in both the main semi and the reju are the ones that most deserve to qualify.

So, introducing the combined qualifier:
*Inspired by Eurovision's combined jury-and-televoting system
*The host adds together the main semi score and reju total (minus the extra 6) of the songs
*The combined qualifier is the highest placing song in this table, that didn't qualify by top10 or reju.​

PROS
*A song liked by both juries qualifies
*More focus is put on the now thriving rest jury
*The song will be statistically deserving of the final
*Eliminates just-missed-out-due-to-semi-allocation
*More qualifiers from the semifinal​

POINTS FOR DISCUSSION
Obviously, the key issue here:
30 finalists?
or
9 main qualifiers?
or
4 PQers?
Each of these solutions would allow for the extra qualifier, but each have their own pros and cons.​

I'm not opening any polls or decisions just yet. First, let's have some discussion, and feel free to brainstorm further on this idea!

I will soon put up an example of which songs would've been the "combined qualifiers" in the past few editions, so that you can see examples for yourself.

I think this could be the positive change NSC has been waiting for, which directly addresses the main problem people have at the moment with qualifiers

YOUR THOUGHTS!
Constructive criticism and advice most welcome 1
I will update and reply to this thread when I get back to England, but for now, pleeease post your reactions!

 

[Sean]

I'm not really that bothered about changing anything with the qualifier system at the moment and I believe that if a song was never meant to qualify through either the main semi or the reju then there wasn't much point in it being in the final (and god knows how many times I've been in such a position xD).

Buuut, this does sound a lot more fairer than the reju qualifier system, although I think that it would be better to replace the reju qualifier altogether with the combined one, so that the size of the final isn't compromised. The final is already quite large and adding 2 extra songs would be too much, especially with a rounded number like 30 which somehow seems so much more than 29. I also think that prequalifying can be hard enough without making the requirement even higher. Likewise, 9 main qualifiers just doesn't seem right.

 

[Scorpion]

I wouldn't change anything. I think that the way everything is, works perfectly, and that there is absolutely no need for changes.

 

[Simon87]

I agree with Scorpion

 

[renzo]

I do not agree with either 30 finalists (its too much), 4 PQS (no way...6 is just perfect) or 9 main qualifiers (just no). The idea behind the combined qualifier sounds pretty good, but i still believe that if it is introduced, something else has to be proposed so that the final remains 28, pqs remain 6 and main quallers remain 10. so my only probable solution would be removing the reju to introduced the combined. But then, do we really need it?

In my opinion, maybe voting in both semis made obligatory would just solve everything, having 6 pqs, 10 from each semi (decided by the total points from ALL the nsc countries)..making a final of 26. As i see from this current edition where i was collecting REJU, 25 ppl voted in the reju, which is nearly all..and i truly believe that the others would have voted if it is made obligatory. But probably this wont be liked either xD

 

[Jukica]

I do not agree with either 30 finalists (its too much), 4 PQS (no way...6 is just perfect) or 9 main qualifiers (just no). The idea behind the combined qualifier sounds pretty good, but i still believe that if it is introduced, something else has to be proposed so that the final remains 28, pqs remain 6 and main quallers remain 10. so my only probable solution would be removing the reju to introduced the combined. But then, do we really need it?

+1 xgood

In my opinion, maybe voting in both semis made obligatory would just solve everything, having 6 pqs, 10 from each semi (decided by the total points from ALL the nsc countries)..making a final of 26. As i see from this current edition where i was collecting REJU, 25 ppl voted in the reju, which is nearly all..and i truly believe that the others would have voted if it is made obligatory. But probably this wont be liked either xD

And I don't agree with this one :/ obligatory voting in both semis would look like we have 2 "smaller finals" (all countries voting) and 1 big final which is made out of these 2 "smaller finals" :/ + some REJU voters are from waiting list


Personally I'm for introducing combine quallers instead of REJU quallers or not changing anything

 

[SpZ]

I would go for 4PQs

 

[Fearnavigatr]

If 30 seems like a whole lot more than 28, very common trick in the market, I would suggest you challenge your own perception. The final contains songs you've heard before, and if you've taken your healthy time to listen to both semis already, you'll only have 6 new songs to listen to and build a fresh perception of regardless of the total amount of finalists.

We've been stale for ages now, we haven't had a major change of format for 53 editions. If the format was perfect, I would agree to leave it stale. Alas, it's not perfect, people are fighting for the chance to be included in the felusive final race, but are bluntly knocked out by none other than lady luck. More people than anyone likes to admit are frustrated by their situations in NSC, and rather than patronizing them for not enjoying the game, perhaps it's time to dissolve some frustration by changing the game? Fun is the whole reason we're all participating anyway, is it not?

The timing is perfect, the situation is perfect, we need this change.

although I think that it would be better to replace the reju qualifier altogether with the combined one

so my only probable solution would be removing the reju to introduced the combined

Personally I'm for introducing combine quallers instead of REJU quallers

This would compromise the role of the rest jury and leave the voters with even less to say, not a good suggestion.

 

[VedatiNet]

I know nobody will agree with me but mu propose is: 28 finalist most vote in the final. Non qualified countries CAN vote but only if they want. When you fail to qualify you lose your interest to vote in the final. Ones who dont are free to vote. Especially in the final like this one (70) when almost all of the songs are boring and you cant find 10 songs to vote for ( my case ) I found it stupid to force you to vote. Will be happy to see if at least one will agree with me.

 

[spiluke]

I like the idea of the combined qualifier but I don't know which solution is best to solve the problem

 

[Sean]

I know nobody will agree with me but mu propose is: 28 finalist most vote in the final. Non qualified countries CAN vote but only if they want. When you fail to qualify you lose your interest to vote in the final. Ones who dont are free to vote. Especially in the final like this one (70) when almost all of the songs are boring and you cant find 10 songs to vote for ( my case ) I found it stupid to force you to vote. Will be happy to see if at least one will agree with me.

 

[MrJadeEwen]

I agree this combined qualifier does sound like a better option. Some countries this edition have missed out purely for this reason. :\ 28 is a perfect number for the final and 6 PQ's is definately an attainable reward for countries. I would suggest taking the main Qualifiers down to 9, 9 is only one less than we already have and if the song that is 10th deserves the final it will have the reju or combined to fall back upon.

The only down side i can find is that it creates a bit more work on the host, however in the aim of fairness i think this combined qualifier sounds like a good idea. Usually i'm against changing things that work well, however this problem of semi allocation is a tough one to get correct (See Bacchus this edition in reju and semi final placing).



Good idea guys , i'd like to see 6 PQ staying and hopefully keeping the final at 28 too so putting down main qualifiers to 9 seems sensible

 

[dogmeat]

I think yall pay too much attention to details. Not like swapping two finalists would make the contest any more interesting. And definitely not like it was worth making the rules less readable. You can't have songs deserving the final more or less than others, as it's purely subjective matter. So i find the whole discussion how to push the most deserving entries into the final pointless.

 

[MrJadeEwen]

if you find it pointless then why would you even bother posting ?

 

[Turkish97]

I wouldn't change anything. I think that the way everything is, works perfectly, and that there is absolutely no need for changes.

+ 99999999999

 

[dogmeat]

if you find it pointless then why would you even bother posting ?

To point out i'm against filling the rules with more and more mess for no valid reason.
And no, someone's favorite missing a final is no valid reason. For anything.

 

[VedatiNet]

:twisted:

 

[VedatiNet]

I know nobody will agree with me but mu propose is: 28 finalist most vote in the final. Non qualified countries CAN vote but only if they want. When you fail to qualify you lose your interest to vote in the final. Ones who dont are free to vote. Especially in the final like this one (70) when almost all of the songs are boring and you cant find 10 songs to vote for ( my case ) I found it stupid to force you to vote. Will be happy to see if at least one will agree with me.

 

[Sean]

Sorry I didnt uderstand this :?::?::?:

Your whole argument basically boils down to a certain level of annoyance at not being in the final, which isn't where you should be approaching this discussion from...

 

[VedatiNet]